Yes, this is important stuff! Well said! Since you're a philosopher, it's worth pointing out that one thing you're wrestling with here is the failure of the "Gospel-Centered" movement to address the complex problem of agency, which I believe is THE philosophical problem of our time (both for Christians and non-Christians). "You cannot do it, but God did," may be true in certain very specific respects, but it is not true enough. Jesus came not merely to replace our efforts but to redeem them, not merely to deny our agency but to call our agency into right relationship with his. “The Son of God suffered unto the death, not that men might not suffer, but that their sufferings might be like His.” -- George MacDonald
To add to your discussion: Being forgiven of my sins does not matter if 2 additional things do not occur. The first is that I have to have hope that I will actually be changed into someone capable of relationship with God (nuf said). The second is that the powers under which I am subject must be defeated and subjected to the authority of Christ. Imagine if during WW2, the allies marched to the border of Germany and declared peace with the German people, but still left Hitler in charge. Sure they’re not getting bombed anymore, but I still wouldn’t find that particularly hopeful. To be forgiven for my sins and made into someone capable of relationship with God, is irrelevant if I am left the citizen of Satan’s empire.
I am becoming increasingly convinced that the subsitutionary theory of the atonement derives its significance from the Christus Victor theory of atonement not the other way around. A gospel that sees Christ defeating the evil powers of our world is much more competent at being able to encompass all of life.
I believe the issue is one of definition. The caution to be “gospel-centred” was a lesson given 50 years ago to point out to the ex-hippies of the Jesus People’s movement that they should do nothing in the way of pure entertainment. They should look for some redemptive value in whatever they do. I believe it is valid today if applied properly. The present Church has upon her, the same mandates as the Church throughout history. The two main mandates are the Gospel Mandate and the Cultural Mandate. One is focused on the spiritual state of our neighbours and the other is to serve our generation by the will of God seeking to make the world a better place. Pursuing things not mandated by God to the Saints is a waste of time.
Yes, this is important stuff! Well said! Since you're a philosopher, it's worth pointing out that one thing you're wrestling with here is the failure of the "Gospel-Centered" movement to address the complex problem of agency, which I believe is THE philosophical problem of our time (both for Christians and non-Christians). "You cannot do it, but God did," may be true in certain very specific respects, but it is not true enough. Jesus came not merely to replace our efforts but to redeem them, not merely to deny our agency but to call our agency into right relationship with his. “The Son of God suffered unto the death, not that men might not suffer, but that their sufferings might be like His.” -- George MacDonald
To add to your discussion: Being forgiven of my sins does not matter if 2 additional things do not occur. The first is that I have to have hope that I will actually be changed into someone capable of relationship with God (nuf said). The second is that the powers under which I am subject must be defeated and subjected to the authority of Christ. Imagine if during WW2, the allies marched to the border of Germany and declared peace with the German people, but still left Hitler in charge. Sure they’re not getting bombed anymore, but I still wouldn’t find that particularly hopeful. To be forgiven for my sins and made into someone capable of relationship with God, is irrelevant if I am left the citizen of Satan’s empire.
I am becoming increasingly convinced that the subsitutionary theory of the atonement derives its significance from the Christus Victor theory of atonement not the other way around. A gospel that sees Christ defeating the evil powers of our world is much more competent at being able to encompass all of life.
I believe the issue is one of definition. The caution to be “gospel-centred” was a lesson given 50 years ago to point out to the ex-hippies of the Jesus People’s movement that they should do nothing in the way of pure entertainment. They should look for some redemptive value in whatever they do. I believe it is valid today if applied properly. The present Church has upon her, the same mandates as the Church throughout history. The two main mandates are the Gospel Mandate and the Cultural Mandate. One is focused on the spiritual state of our neighbours and the other is to serve our generation by the will of God seeking to make the world a better place. Pursuing things not mandated by God to the Saints is a waste of time.